How Old Will We Appear In Eternity?

The passage reflects on the process of aging and the nature of bodies in both Heaven and the New Earth. It suggests we will have bodies that differ from Earth’s and speculates about their characteristics. While acknowledging the mystery of God’s plans, it emphasizes the importance of faith in Jesus for eternal life and encourages spiritual growth and stewardship.

We are used to the process of aging. We start as little babies, somewhere we hit our maximum as far as strength, health, and appearance, maybe intelligence peaks at another time, and then comes the long downgrade until death. Unless we die early, that is the course of it. In other articles in this blog I make the case that we will have a body of some sort in whatever place we end up. There is a Heavenly body, there is a resurrected Earthly body, there is likely a body for Sheol, there is some form in Hell. We are never “naked” as Paul calls it in 2 Corinthians 5, unless we are naked in Hell.

There is precious little information about the body we will have in Heaven. We can say that it is without a sinful nature, it is beyond the curse, we can presume it is recognizable to others, it isn’t a radical departure from our current body plan, but that is about it. Is there an age equivalency to changes we go through here?

The only thing that might be construed as speaking to our question is Isaiah 65 which expressly speaks of the New Earth and may have some real interpretive issues that go with it.

No more shall there be in it
    an infant who lives but a few days,
    or an old man who does not fill out his days,
for the young man shall die a hundred years old,
    and the sinner a hundred years old shall be accursed.

Isaiah 65:20 (ESV)

Because this speaks of death, some have interpreted this as referring to a millennial earthly kingdom. The text expressly says “a New Earth”, so I don’t think that is the solution. Eternal life is eternal. We can say that from many other parts of Scripture. What is up with this?

This passage is likely a figure of speech. It contrasts eternity to the painful and unpredictable pattern of our world. Could it literally suggest a life process in the New Earth where you are born, grow up, replicate, grow to maturity, and then start over? We will find out, won’t we? There are creatures on Earth that do this today. If we were without sin and the curse, each phase of life would present its own unique pleasures. Maybe the New Earth is like this. That doesn’t mean that Heaven is the same.

There is plenty of mystery about what God has planned for us. Even the situation of having an “eternal” body in Heaven, as well as, a resurrected “spiritual” body on the New Earth and how those work together is a complete unknown. But I like to try to imagine it anyway.

How about this? When we die in Christ we find ourselves in a uniquely beautiful Heavenly body with some new capacities like instant recognition of others, the ability to travel long distances instantly or nearly so, and maybe more. Sort of an enhanced 25 year old forever. Then post-judgment day a body for this time-space continuum which interfaces with the Heavenly body. Maybe this body experiences the joys of aging. I could be a kid in the New Earth and then transition to an optimized adult in Heaven and back. Does that appeal?

Is there sex? Maybe. The reasoning to exclude it is presumptive. Maybe there is much better than sex. Will we remain the same gender? If so, there will be no negativity associated with it. Are we species fixed? There is nothing in the Bible to suggest that you could spend a week as a salamander. Sorry.

One faulty idea that you don’t have to worry about is that you are the same age that you die at on Earth. If you are old when you die, then you are old in Heaven. That is a weird idea but I have heard it.

Get ready for something great–however it works. We gain access to this only because of Jesus. We shouldn’t even delude ourselves about gaining this by default, or being “good enough”, or traveling a different path to Heaven. The Bible is very emphatic and clear about this. It makes sense too. If there were multiple paths, then Jesus would have been spared His suffering for us. Jesus won the right for us to inherit this. It is offered to us as a gift. When we are connected to Christ through faith and baptism, we are ready to go.

Complete your course of this life with good stewardship of what you have, seeking your God-given purpose, protecting your connection to Christ with God’s Word, the Lord’s Supper, the fellowship of other Christians, growing in Christ’s qualities. Always keep your eyes on the unseen prize.

The Bible’s Bad News

The text discusses the dual nature of the Bible, presenting both bad and good news. It argues that all humans are born with a sinful nature leading to eternal separation from God, but offers hope through Jesus Christ. Belief in Him is essential for salvation and eternal life, forming the crux of the Christian faith.

Before we are exposed to the Bible, a person’s view of themselves and probably of other people is that we are basically good. Similarly, most people want to believe in existence after physical death. We also want it to be good. So many passively believe that there is some sort of Heaven or other favorable existence awaiting them. It is very natural. I want to believe it too.

The Bible is meant to be extremely good news, but getting to the good news first requires hearing and accepting some very bad news that we don’t want to be true. The problem is that the proof of the bad news is all around us. The bad news is this: every human being is born with a distorted, sinful nature that did not come from God. That nature is probably resident in our DNA. It came from our common ancestors, so everyone is impacted. The distorted coding of our DNA produces a body, in particular a brain, that cannot believe the words of God on its own, it does not retain the ability to know and communicate with God that we had, it produces a personality that basically selfish, it creates desires for things and actions that God forbids, it creates a tendency to follow the ways of its designer and the designer is Satan.

Who wants to believe that? I don’t. The bad news gets worse. The condition of having a sinful nature, if unchecked, produces a sinful live that can be wildly dysfunctional and short.

Worse than that is the news about the default, eternal destiny of a human being. Sinners who do not and naturally cannot keep God’s laws perfectly will be permanently cut off from God and will suffer a horrible existence permanently. That is certainly something I would rather reject as unthinkable and false.

Then I look at humanity’s track record. It isn’t pretty. I look deeply at myself, and even though I was saved in my infancy, I see it. I see selfishness. I see the difficulty of believing God’s Word. I see the tendency to sin. I can’t argue against the accusation. I also am cornered into believing that the Bible’s presentation of the default destiny of a human is true.

The Bible, however, isn’t done after the presentation of the bad news. It is good news. The news is that God foresaw the problem we would have and produced a plan to counter it before the problem actually came to be. Objectively, it is a strange plan. Many are not inclined to believe it. There seems to be simpler ways to go about it. In a way it seems too good to be true. It is counter just about every other way the world works.

God will follow His demand for perfection. He does not deviate from His original requirements. That is how He is, so there is no “easier” route. He creates instead a way for naturally imperfect humans to have perfection.

This is what Jesus is for. The proof of Jesus’ historicity is strong. There are clear, specific prophecies about Him that can be shown to have existed before His birth. He did a slew of clearly miraculous things before eye witnesses who later went to their premature deaths as believers and vocal witnesses. He won over His own brother who initially did not believe that Jesus was the Messiah, the one prophesied about (who would?). He appeared to and won over a sworn enemy in Saul/ Paul. Outside of the biblical evidence are mentions of Christ and Christians dating to the first century. You have to want the narrative of the Bible to be untrue to write this stuff off.

The good news is this:

6 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

John 3:16-18, Jesus speaking (ESV)

It works out this way. We can’t keep God’s demands perfectly, so Jesus (the incarnated as a human Son of God)keeps the Law without error. He isn’t born with the same genetic sinful nature because of His unusual, virgin birth. Then, for the legal condemnation that we have earned, He voluntarily dies on the cross during which He is forsaken by the Father (i.e. damned) temporarily, probably three and one half hours. This fulfills half (the big half) of God’s requirements for sinners. The other half is that we physically must die. It is our only “contribution”.

The way that Jesus’ accomplishments get applied to an individual is not God just declaring it so. It isn’t even that we believe God’s promise and God takes note of it and writes our name in a book, though that happens too. It is that God somehow unites us with Jesus through something He does in the background when we are baptized in the name of Jesus. The fulfillment of the Law, the required getting through our sinful nature to create faith, and the uniting us with Christ is all done as a gift to us–a very valuable and costly gift. It is complex. It is different from “you get what you deserve or pay for”, which is the general rule of how the world works. It does seem too good to be true, because this mechanism can theoretically forgive even some terrible sinners. It depends on God getting through to them somehow.

Another thing that I would rather not believe is that the majority of mankind won’t benefit from this historical and generous opportunity.

13 “Enter by the narrow gate. For the gate is wide and the way is easy that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. 14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

Matthew 7:13-14 (ESV)

That means that some pretty nice people will still die in their sins because they rejected Jesus. Please don’t be one of them. Please don’t be a part of the “”many. Be a part of the “few”. The eternity spelled out for us that I have tried to describe in this blog is both terrible and beautiful. Jesus is the key to being a part of the beautiful. I know that the number of the few will be a large number of people. That is good. It can be more.

Your Eternal Self

The post explores the concept of eternity through a theological lens, comparing God to a geometric line that exists infinitely. It discusses the nature of the spirit and body, eternal life, and the implications of sin on existence. It emphasizes God’s desire to recreate believers in a form suited for eternal life.

It is admittedly hard to conceptualize what “eternal” means. We can think of a long time, but not eternal. I sometimes use a math concept to get people to understand what they are. It helps.

God is like a line in geometry. I line goes infinitely in both directions. When Moses encountered God in the burning bush, he asked for God’s name:

14 God said to Moses, “Yahweh” And he said, “Say this to the people of Israel: ‘Yahweh has sent me to you.’”

Exodus 3:14

Yahweh is a verb form of “to be” not found in English. God always was, is, and always will be, is what is means. He is the whole line. People who don’t believe in eternal life think we are a segment. A clear beginning and a clear end in death. God has made us to be a ray. We do have a beginning at our conception. We do not pre-exist this except that God knows us. But we will have no end.

Our bodies clearly have an end. The body you have is a segment. You may feel the terminal point creeping up on you right now. We are more complicated than just a body. We are for now this body, our spirit, and the interface between the two, our soul.

Having a spirit is clearly a part of being created in the image of God. It is not cognition, intelligence, emotion, or imagination. It is something not properly a part of this universe. Our spirit is coupled with this body through a mechanism that has not been revealed to us. It is probably something on a very small scale, perhaps the micro-tubules found on our neurons.

What faculties are resident in our spirit? I’m not sure. It does become hard to sort. Things like memory, reason, consciousness, even senses can all be associated with parts of the brain which belongs to the body, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they are resident there. They may just interact with the body there. People having a Near Death Experience (NDE) can have all of the above without use of the body.

One thing I can say with certainty is a part of body and not the spirit is our sinful nature. The genetic damage we have all inherited that builds our body to be unreceptive to God and inclined to sin is cooked into the flesh. That is why we need to physically die. We need to get rid of this body when it is time.

Can our spirit simply float around without a body for long? Paul suggests that this wouldn’t be desirable:

5 For we know that if the tent that is our earthly home is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this tent we groan, longing to put on our heavenly dwelling, 3 if indeed by putting it on we may not be found naked. 4 For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened—not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life.

2 Corinthians 5:1-4 (ESV)

Being “unclothed” in verse 4 is being a spirit without a body. You really don’t want that. You want to be “further clothed”: to get rid of your current body/tent and upgrade to a body built for Heaven (v.1). I would assume that our spirit will interface with that body either through a similar means or something completely different.

Don’t think that you are done. God is very determined not to lose in the struggle for this time-space continuum. While your body for here is damaged and will die, He wants to remake this universe and remake a body for you for this universe.

How would that work? Now we are pushing a bit into a mystery. We don’t know how that will work. At the time of Judgment Day, Christ’s visible return, and the making of a New Heaven and Earth, there will a resurrection of the dead. Will God recycle what remains of earthly bodies? Not sure. I doubt it. He will make something that is uniquely us. Do we still have the “(body) eternal in the Heavens?” I would assume from the word “eternal” used in 1 Corinthians 5:1 that the answer is “yes”. I will be a spirit connected to a body or bodies at that time and forever.

Can I mess this up? Until we get rid of our sin-damaged body the answer is “yes”. We are saved completely by God’s action. Jesus kept the Law. Jesus absorbed the eternal punishment for our sin by being forsaken on the cross. The Holy Spirit has connected us (if we are connected) to Jesus. Normally, through the process of baptism. We can throw this away. The biblically listed methods of doing this are: distorting the Gospel (Gal. 5:2-4), being unrepentant despite the pleas of the Spirit (numerous verses), neglecting God’s means of keeping our connection viable (Parable of the Sower), refusing to forgive (Lord’s Prayer/Matthew 6). After our death, there is nothing to suggest the possibility of undoing our salvation. Isaiah 65:20 is meant to be rhetorical.

Is a damned person eternal? Their resurrected body doesn’t seem to be:

“For behold, the day is coming, burning like an oven, when all the arrogant and all evildoers will be stubble. The day that is coming shall set them ablaze, says the Lord of hosts, so that it will leave them neither root nor branch. 2 But for you who fear my name, the sun of righteousness shall rise with healing in its wings. You shall go out leaping like calves from the stall. 3 And you shall tread down the wicked, for they will be ashes under the soles of your feet, on the day when I act, says the Lord of hosts.

Malachi 4:1-3 (ESV)

They won’t need a body for the New Earth because they won’t be staying.

46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

Matthew 25:46 (ESV)

Saying What You Need to Say Before You Die

This blog concerns itself mostly with what happens after death. I say “mostly” because what happens after death does have major implications on what should happen before death. There are a number of things we should talk about with people who matter to us. In that list I would include that we should be reconciled with those from whom we are estranged, communicate our love to people, and communicate the Gospel to them in the most honest and vulnerable way possible.

Sometimes people just feel they need to communicate about financial matters and personal wishes. This belies a very sterile view of our priorities and pretty much screams, “when we’re dead, we are gone.” These things do matter, but that is what a will and perhaps one printed page would take of. The other things are far more important and perhaps scary, so we are inclined to procrastinate. You might even be afraid of blowback or failure. I get it, but you will regret not being brave. Perhaps speaking about such deep, emotional, and serious matters is something you have avoided all your life.

Let’s start with reconciliation. If you are estranged, a victory isn’t necessarily suddenly becoming close. A victory is mutual understanding, forgiveness, and peace in your relationship. Obviously there are lots of relationships and situations that can end in estrangement. I can only speak in general terms here.

If reconciliation matters to you, then you initiate the contact. Face-to-face is best for this, but not always possible. You might get a stiff arm from the person at first. They might be coping with the situation by avoidance and perhaps denial of their own culpability. Be persistent. It might seem annoying to the other person, but it also demonstrates sincerity on your part.

If you do get a chance to communicate, be sure that you understand why they are estranged from you. You may have your own reasons, but you may not know how they feel. Ask them for their take on the situation. Don’t look for reasons to disagree. Look for reasons for you to take some responsibility for the situation. Own your part and let them know it first. Then ask if you may share how you feel. Don’t be angry, but be matter-of-fact and humble. They may be defensive. Let them know that you just want to be understood. This is how you feel. If you can say, “I used to feel that way, but I now want the matter to be water under the bridge”, then let them know that.

Sometimes it is better to be wronged than to harbor anger and to leave this world unreconciled. Are there corrective actions that you can take? Be the bigger person. Let the other person decide to act for their part. God is judge.

Bringing another person around to some form of repentance often takes time. Don’t wait to start the process until you are at death’s door. Maybe you can ask to speak about it again in the near future.

Reconciliation does not always work. But it does feel good to know that you tried.

Saying that you love someone shouldn’t be that hard. Maybe your family culture has not included using the word “love”. Use the word “love”. To love isn’t necessarily the same as enjoying someone. To love is to want the very best for them. To love is to mean that they matter deeply to you. Explain what you mean when you say, “I love you.” Maybe such statements as, “I pray for you every day”, or “I want us to have a continued (or better) relationship in Heaven”, or “I am proud of you”. These can matter a great deal to a person. They can feel strangely awkward for some, but it is liberating to say.

Then there is the matter of sharing the Gospel. Maybe religion has been a divisive topic for you. Sharing the Gospel should begin with loving the person. You may need to restate that first.

Do they know what you believe? Rehearse a short explanation of why you think talking about Jesus matters:

“I want you to know (or I know you know) that I believe the Jesus is a real person. Not a fiction. I also believe that I am a sinful human being. My hope for eternal life is that Jesus lived the perfect life I could not live, and that Jesus absorbed the sentence that I earned by being sinful. That included His death and being damned/forsaken on the cross. It is my only hope.”

If you don’t know, ask them what they believe about God and eternal life. look for points in common. If you can articulate why you believe what you believe then share it without evoking a debate. Give it in a FYI (for your information) manner. That is not threatening or contrarian. You do not argue somebody into the Kingdom of God, you expose them. The Spirit works where He can work through the exposure.

Expose them to your love for them. “I do disagree with your idea of God, but I truly love you. I want you to be with me in eternity. That is why I am talking to you about Jesus. I want to do all I can. I can’t make you believe. I can show you Jesus.”

You may not get the satisfaction of seeing the person confess their faith or be baptized. At minimum you will have the satisfaction of knowing that you did what you could. That matters. I expect it will also matter in Heaven, no matter the result.

If you are nearing death and actually planning your funeral. Consider including either a read statement or video clip of expressing your love and explaining Jesus. It can be very powerful coming from you posthumously. A pastor can do it, but you would be better. Too many funerals are just eulogies. You want a funeral to work for you. You want impact.

Is There Such a Thing as Purgatory?

This article examine the origin of the doctrine of Purgatory, which is unique to the Roman Catholic Church. It looks at Scriptural, Apocryphal, and human reason and understanding. It also examines the question of where sin resides in our being.

Yes. But we call it “seminary”. That is just a joke. The doctrine of purgatory, which is unique to the Roman Catholic Church is no joke. I think it is somewhat dangerous. But let’s look at the origin, andthe proof, which is very thin.

The idea is that there is a place and a period in your existence where you have been saved by the grace of Christ but to reach your Heavenly state of perfection you have to go through some suffering in purgatory. How long this will take varies from person to person. It is also something that might be shortened based on the actions of others on your behalf. It is not punishment, per se, it is more polishing.

The doctrine of purgatory does not arrive on the scene until the 12th century. It doesn’t get endorsement until the 13th at the Council of Lyon (1274AD). That is long ago, but awfully late. Could the Holy Spirit wait to reveal a truth until nearly 1300 years after Christ. Sure. Is that what happened? I personally doubt it.

The source of this teaching comes from two things that are owned by the Roman Catholic Church, a likely third thing, and I expect a dangerous fourth.

First, this:

11 For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw— 13 each one’s work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. 14 If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. 15 If anyone’s work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

1 Corinthians 3:11-15 (ESV)

I love quoting this verse. They see this event as something that happens immediately upon death. I would argue that this is our Judgment Day experience. Judgment Day is described in a couple of places as a judgment of our works, and here you have detail. The fire is a way of revealing our acts and motives. It is not a means of purging our sinful acts and motives. Consider the end of this one:

10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

2 Peter 3:10 (ESV)

This is clearly of Judgment Day description with the “works that are done on it” being exposed. That is what 1 Corinthians 3:13 is describing. The person whose works are “burned up” is still saved. Why? Because we are saved by Jesus, not our works. We are rewarded for our works.

One other thing gets dragged into the reasoning for the teaching of Purgatory, and it is from a source that wasn’t even considered Scripture in the 13th century.

43 And making a gathering, he sent twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection,44 (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,)45 And because he considered that they who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them.

46 It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins.

2 Maccabees 12:43-46 (Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition)

2 Maccabees is a part of the Apocrypha which isn’t included in the Roman Catholic canon of Scripture until the Council of Trent (1563). The reasoning is that someone is praying for the dead in hopes that they might “rise again”. This story’s context is that some of the Jews who lived in the 2nd century BC prayed for some of their men killed in battle. Would these people be in Purgatory? No. This brings me to the third likely source of the doctrine of Purgatory. Purgatory is a misunderstanding of Sheol. https://afterdeathsite.com/2025/07/22/sheol-as-a-waiting-room/. (There is more about Sheol/Hades on this website. Use the search box to look it up or click “Sheol” in the topic section and scroll down)

Sheol is not a place of purging. For the Old Testament righteous, it is a reasonably nice place to wait for the atonement of sins which will happen with Jesus. They are in the “good neighborhood” of Sheol. The Roman Catholic Church has this. They call it “The Limbo of the Fathers”. Some church bodies just use the term from the story of Lazarus and the Rich Man and call it “the bosom of Abraham”. For the damned, Sheol was and is a place of suffering waiting for Judgment Day.

Why pray for the dead? First, I don’t recognize 1 Maccabees as Scripture. Then, I think you have to be careful about how you interpret a narrative, even in Scripture. Just because they did it, doesn’t make it right. That said people in the Limbo of the Fathers really wouldn’t need prayer nor sacrifice. They just needed Jesus to arrive and do what he did.

Is it wrong or pointless to pray for the dead? A person in Heaven doesn’t need it. What about the bad neighborhood of Sheol? Are they judged and damned and beyond hope? That all comes down to the meaning of 1 Peter 4:6.

6 For this is why the gospel was preached even to those who are dead, that though judged in the flesh the way people are, they might live in the spirit the way God does.

1 Peter 4:6 (ESV)

The context of this passage is Jesus’ decent into “Hell” (which should be “Sheol”)https://afterdeathsite.com/2017/03/14/christs-descent-into-hell-part-1/. (There are five parts to this). Does this say that the currently damned in Sheol might still be redeemed by Christ? It would explain why Jesus preached to people from Noah’s day (1 Peter 3:18-20). This is not nullified by Hebrews 9:27, which seems to be the one proof text for those who want to say otherwise.

27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,

Hebrews 9:27 (ESV)

The context of this verse does not suggest that final judgment comes immediately on death. It is simply talking about Jesus only needing to die once.

The idea of needing to be purged raises the question of where sinfulness actually resides. Is it in the earthly body, our spirit, or both? “Sinful nature” seems to suggest the body; even specifically our DNA which is the source of our nature. Paul blames the body in Romans 7. Jesus’ virgin birth also points to the need for a body without the starting contamination of sin. What about our “will”? Using the definition of what we are as body, soul, and spirit. The soul seems to be the interface of spirit and body. That is where I would surmise the “will” resides. Its connection to the body is why we don’t have a perfectly free will.

The body is the problem. We purge the body by dying. There is no need for something further.

A final reason, and a dangerous one, for the teaching of Purgatory I fear is a misunderstanding of grace. It is tough to accept salvation as a gift. It feels like we need to add something or experience something to complete it. This idea gets close to the error of the Galatians. The Galatians believed in salvation through Christ but requiring circumcision. That was enough to invalidate the Gospel.

2 Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you. 3 I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law.4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.

Galatians 5:2-4 (ESV)

This is why the teaching of Purgatory, even holding to it as tradition, seems dangerous on top of erroneous to me. It does not pass the scrutiny of Scripture and falls into a category where people come up with it via bad logic. The Judaizers appealed to tradition to argue for circumcision being added to grace. Their understanding of the value of tradition was fatal.

Will Good People Be Lost?

The text discusses challenging biblical concepts, particularly the harsh consequences of sin and the unpredictability of salvation. It highlights that both minor and major sins lead to damnation unless atoned for by Jesus. It explores divine love and justice, emphasizing God’s plan for salvation, the unique role of Jesus, and the urgency of sharing this message with others.

There are a couple of things that God reveals in the Bible that are tough to accept. One is the severity of the punishment for sin. Sin can manifest itself in people in ways that are not that destructive. Still, unless it is atoned for by Jesus minor sins are as damning as major ones, and damnation is serious and permanent.

The other difficult thing is that some fairly serious criminals can come to faith and be saved, while other nice people never do and, yes, they are lost. That doesn’t seem fair to us, but we have the wrong perspective on the situation. It is almost inherent to our being to feel that good people deserve good things and bad people deserve bad things. Other world religions fall in line with this tendency. But that is not how it always works in this situation.

If I were to add a third difficult thing to accept it would be that a God of love would accept this arrangement. To sort this out, we have to take a deep dive into the character of the being who has created all things and who is the ultimate judge of what is good and evil.

The first thing to note is that God didn’t create any being in order to damn them. He foresaw that certain individuals would rebel against His primacy and that sin and evil would be a real thing, but rather than scrap Creation God had a plan from the beginning.

4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight.

Ephesians 1:4 (NIV)

The plan wasn’t for every creature. It doesn’t have a way to save or reform Satan, a cherubim/seraphim. It doesn’t have a way to save rebellious angels/demons. Their rebellion is different in a way. They choose out of a completely free will to reject God. Adam and Eve did not conceive of evil on their own. Satan deceived them. The rest of us are deeply influenced by our “sinful nature”. This is some sort of genetic abnormality created by the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil (Genesis 3) and passed along to everyone. Other creatures are dragged into this cycle of sin, death, and decay unwillingly.

The plan shows the primary characteristics of God, which is love and justice. He is willing to make to ultimate sacrifice to save. The Son of God becomes a human and absorbs the main penalty for sin Himself. But God doesn’t just forgive because He can. He keeps His law in tact. Jesus even asked if this could be done a different way as He prayed in the Garden of Gethsemane. The Father’s commitment to not arbitrarily change His own law led to Jesus going through with the plan.

25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Romans 3:25-26 (NIV)

He is “just” (i.e. He won’t change the Law), and the justifier (He makes a sacrifice out of love to save.)

A further statement about God’s intent is found in the most famous passage in Scripture:

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.

John 3:16-17 (NIV)

Because of the nature of the plan, Jesus is not an option. He is the only way to stand before God as sinless. Even very good people are sinful. We all do something contrary to God’s will every day. We are all modified physically from what we are meant to be. When we call somebody “good” or think of ourselves as “good”, we are speaking relative to others we have known or heard about. We don’t meet that criteria relative to God.

“Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good.”

Matthew 19:17 (NIV)

Even knowing the interplay between God’s love and God’s justice, the situation of those who are not connected to Christ can be disturbing. Especially if we know them personally. It is not a bad thing to be disturbed. God is disturbed. It should move us to do what we can. We can tell people of the pertinent parts of Jesus’ story and urge them to read it if they can. We can tell of the promise and the Bible’s description of our human situation. We can even share the rational proofs for the reality of the Bible’s revelation. (Please look at my other blog: http://givingchrist.com for some of these.). We can also demonstrate the love of God through action. God must do the rest. If there is a chance of connecting them to Christ, God will do whatever He can during life and possibly beyond it until Judgement Day. But people will be lost, and some of them will be “good people”.

How Do You Thank God for Eternal Life?

Thanksgiving in the United States, established by Lincoln, is a time for family gatherings and feasting, but often lacks true reflection. The author emphasizes gratefulness for life’s blessings and the importance of recognizing their impermanence due to sin. True thankfulness arises from understanding eternal life through Jesus, which motivates a life aligned with God’s commandments.

Next week in the United States we are celebrating Thanksgiving. For many people it is time to get together with family, eat too much, maybe go to a parade and then watch football. There isn’t much thankful reflection. But the national holiday was established by Abraham Lincoln in 1863 for thankful reflection.

Because God has reached me, I have a connection to Jesus. I know that I am saved by His life and death. I currently have eternal life. That is significantly different from eternal existence that every human has. I have a place with God. I haven’t experienced Heaven, being rid of my limited and sinful body, having a heavenly body, or a resurrected earthly body yet. But I will. My lack of experience does dampen my thankfulness, however.

Can I get past my lack of experience? Here is where reflection comes in. I want to be thankful for all the good things currently in my life. There are plenty of them. I also want to acknowledge that these things are temporary and not perfect. Everything and everyone is impacted by sin and the curse. My life would be utterly meaningless without something good coming after my death. Just read the book of Ecclesiastes and see how depressed Solomon, who is a very accomplished, wealthy and wise person, feels about his life without a knowledge of eternal life through Jesus. I have knowledge of eternal life through Jesus. I am aging, but my “glory days” are all ahead of me, and they are really a big deal. Reflect on that for a bit.

You can say or sing thanks. You can go to church. We at least have a worship service on Thanksgiving. But if you would ask Jesus, “How can I thank you, Lord?” He would tell you:

15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments.”

John 14:15 (ESV)

There are many motivations to do what God teaches us is good and right. Love of God and thankfulness rise to the top. Don’t limit this to Thanksgiving Day. It deserves better. Thank God with your life.

Do keep in mind, that keeping God’s commandments can no longer save you. You had to do it perfectly, and ship sailed for you long ago. Now you have a different motivation. Jesus did the heavy lifting that you could not do. You can respond thankfully.

We really don’t appreciate the scope of what has been done for us. We don’t grasp the difficulty of what Jesus did. We don’t understand the depth of horror that awaits those who go to Judgment Day without the forgiveness of their sins. We don’t understand how great eternal life without sinful nature, without the curse, in the vast creativeness and beauty of what God has prepared for us. And we don’t fully appreciate how enthralling it will be to see God face-to-face. Yet, for the little we can imagine, we have plenty of reason to be happy and thankful.

If you don’t know much about what comes next for those who belong to Christ, then explore the articles of this blog. Use the search bar and look for Heaven, the New Earth, and then look at other things in the topic column.

Have a great Thanksgiving.

What Is Satan?

The post explores the biblical figure of Satan, discussing his nature, identities, and presence in both Heaven and Earth, including his manifestation as the King of Tyre. It argues that Satan is not merely a myth but a complex being with significant influence over human history and actions, rooted in scriptural evidence.

Satan is a name found in several places in the Bible and many places in popular culture. He had some pseudonyms: the Devil, Lucifer, the Deceiver, the Accuser, Beelzebub, among others. I would like to deal with the question of what is this being. We will only touch on such tangential questions as what is he like, what can he do, and where is he.

Let’s start with a prominent assumption: Satan is just a myth and a way to personify evil. Not many people want Satan to be a real, thinking, active being. Without direct, obvious interaction it is pretty easy to dismiss a real Satan. Even the majority of Christians do that. The intel that we have has to come ultimately out of revelation from God. Otherwise, we are unlikely to know. While Satan isn’t a primary theme of Scripture, he shows up more than you might think. The context is always personal. It does not seem to be talking about evil showing up as a concept. Is it mythical? Suspend that thought for moment.

To get at what Satan actually is, first we must see where he can be present. Frequently, Satan is depicted as being in Heaven, like in the challenge to God to test Job (Job 1:7). He is also shows up on Earth, like in the Garden of Eden and others. He does seem to be able to either disguise himself or to occupy a human being (2 Corinthians 11:14, Luke 22:3). With that information I would like us to consider a passage that doesn’t use “Satan” by name.

11 Moreover, the word of the Lord came to me: 12 “Son of man, raise a lamentation over the king of Tyre, and say to him, Thus says the Lord God:

“You were the signet of perfection,
    full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden, the garden of God;
    every precious stone was your covering,
sardius, topaz, and diamond,
    beryl, onyx, and jasper,
sapphire, emerald, and carbuncle;
    and crafted in gold were your settings
    and your engravings.
On the day that you were created
    they were prepared.
14 You were an anointed guardian cherub.
    I placed you; you were on the holy mountain of God;
    in the midst of the stones of fire you walked.
15 You were blameless in your ways
    from the day you were created,
    till unrighteousness was found in you.
16 In the abundance of your trade
    you were filled with violence in your midst, and you sinned;
so I cast you as a profane thing from the mountain of God,
    and I destroyed you, O guardian cherub,
    from the midst of the stones of fire.
17 Your heart was proud because of your beauty;
    you corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor.
I cast you to the ground;
    I exposed you before kings,
    to feast their eyes on you.
18 By the multitude of your iniquities,
    in the unrighteousness of your trade
    you profaned your sanctuaries;
so I brought fire out from your midst;
    it consumed you,
and I turned you to ashes on the earth
    in the sight of all who saw you.
19 All who know you among the peoples
    are appalled at you;
you have come to a dreadful end
    and shall be no more forever.”

Ezekiel 28:11-19 (ESV)

So is this lament about Satan or the King of Tyre at Ezekiel’s time? I think the answer is “yes”. Satan either disguised himself or possessed a person and was the King of Tyre. I say this because much of this story could not apply to a normal person and it then gives part of Satan’s backstory. The end (v.18b-19) could apply to Satan as manifested as the King. It could also be prophetic of Satan’s ultimate fate.

What does it tell us? That Satan is a cherub. Cherub’s are not fat, little, baby angels that dispense toilet paper. The word means “living one”. Ezekiel uses that term in Ezekiel 1 as he describes the creatures that accompany God. It is also picked up in Revelation 4. In Isaiah’s vision of heaven in Isaiah 6, he uses the term “seraphim” or “burning ones”. This is just how they look to Isaiah. They are clearly the same creatures: four faces, four to six wings, what looks like eyes on their wings. In fact cherubim have wings, angels are never said to have wings; but it seems impossible to get people or AI to get that popular depiction out of their heads. Cherubim and Seraphim are synonyms. They are not angels. This is very restricted club. A limited creation by God. There seems to be just four in Isaiah, Ezekiel and Revelation. Satan would make a fifth.

Was or is Satan nasty looking? No, very beautiful, at least at first. Satan wasn’t evil from the start either. He was a creature of freewill and invented rebellion against God. It is important to note that Satan isn’t an equivalent of God in power, but just evil, even if he momentarily thought he was. Isaiah 14 has a similar passage. This one nominally against the King of Babylon.

Sheol beneath is stirred up
    to meet you when you come;
it rouses the shades to greet you,
    all who were leaders of the earth;
it raises from their thrones
    all who were kings of the nations.
10 All of them will answer
    and say to you:
‘You too have become as weak as we!
    You have become like us!’
11 Your pomp is brought down to Sheol,
    the sound of your harps;
maggots are laid as a bed beneath you,
    and worms are your covers.

12 “How you are fallen from heaven,
    O Day Star, son of Dawn!
How you are cut down to the ground,
    you who laid the nations low!
13 You said in your heart,
    ‘I will ascend to heaven;
above the stars of God
    I will set my throne on high;
I will sit on the mount of assembly
    in the far reaches of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
    I will make myself like the Most High.’
15 But you are brought down to Sheol,
    to the far reaches of the pit.

Isaiah 14:9-15 (ESV)

While this passage could easily be understood as describing the delusional fantasies of the King of Babylon, it also could be describing a Satan possessed man. The human King of Babylon ends up in Sheol (you can search above for “Sheol” in this blog), but a bit a Satan’s backstory is revealed. He thought he could be God. Is that naïveté, stupidity, or pride? Cherubim seem to have extraordinary powers, but they are no where near God in that category. Satan is not the evil equivalent of Jesus either as the Mormons proclaim.

In Revelation 12, Satan is cast to Earth and banished from Heaven in connection with the victory of Jesus. We do not have a comprehensive report on what he can or cannot do. What pushes him out the realm of myth for me is not only the consistent talk all through Scripture of Satan being an actual, created being; but it is also the horrid history of mankind.

Humans are capable of great evil all by ourselves, but I doubt that we would reach the depths that we have gone without significant outside help. Satan can possess, manifest and influence with great effectiveness. It would not surprise me if the nastiest characters in human history were either Satan in disguise, possessed by Satan, or under extreme influence. I don’t think evil could hold together as a system, movement, or institution the way that it has without such help.

Am I being superstitious or just ignorant of our capacity for evil? Again, I defer to Scripture. Society has swung from finding Satan under every rock to the opposite extreme of dismissing his existence. The truth is likely in between.

God’s Declaration In Isaiah 66

The content discusses the prophetic insights of Isaiah, emphasizing accurate predictions concerning Jesus and His significance beyond Israel. It highlights themes of eternal life and the New Earth, expressing God’s promise to reach all nations. The conclusion warns of the consequences for those rejecting Jesus, presenting a stark contrast to the hope provided in faith.

Looks into the future within the Old Testament are common. That is what prophecy is. We are living far enough in the future from the time of Isaiah that almost everything in it we can examine through hindsight. Almost.

Isaiah had warnings for the people of Israel and for the surrounding nations. It has all come true to my knowledge. It is so accurate that skeptics conclude that Isaiah had to be written after the fact, but there is no proof of this. Isaiah also spoke a lot about the coming of Jesus: virgin birth, living in Galilee, heir of David, widely rejected by the Jews, put through a judgment process where He did not defend himself, crucified for the salvation of others, and buried with the rich. They would be impossible or undesirable events to stage.

Toward the end of Isaiah there is a large and confusing section about the New Earth which is still future even to us. Check out my take on this section here: https://afterdeathsite.com/2022/05/24/wrestling-with-isaiah-65/

Then there are the final verses of the last chapter. It speaks about some stuff that is in our rear-view mirror and some that is not. It starts like this:

18 “For I know their works and their thoughts, and the time is coming to gather all nations and tongues. And they shall come and shall see my glory, 19 and I will set a sign among them. And from them I will send survivors to the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, who draw the bow, to Tubal and Javan, to the coastlands far away, that have not heard my fame or seen my glory. And they shall declare my glory among the nations.

Isaiah 66:18-19 (ESV)

It is intriguing (to me) to ponder what constituted the right time to send Jesus to fulfill the Law and create an opening for people to have eternal life with God starting with Heaven and then later adding the New Earth. With this event comes a spreading out of knowledge about the God who encountered Israel for millennia, the events around Jesus’ life, and the promise of eternal life. God didn’t keep His promise within the borders of a chosen people. He opened the doors to everyone starting most likely 33AD. His description of “the nations” is strange to us, but must have been well known to the contemporaries of Isaiah. “They” in verse 19 must be the early disciples. The communication of God’s actions and the promise of eternal life continues with the disciples of Jesus today all around the world.

20 And they shall bring all your brothers from all the nations as an offering to the Lord, on horses and in chariots and in litters and on mules and on dromedaries, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, says the Lord, just as the Israelites bring their grain offering in a clean vessel to the house of the Lord. 21 And some of them also I will take for priests and for Levites, says the Lord.

Isaiah 66:20-21 (ESV)

Not only was it surprise to hear that God would reach out to other nations, but an even bigger surprise that some of them would be used like the priests and Levites. This chosen group served in the temple as their sole occupation. They were chosen because of the faithfulness of one clan during the Exodus. In the future this would be opened up. I am such a person.

Another surprise is that these saved foreigners would be “your brothers”. This is not a promise to gather the dispersed Jewish people but rather to gather the elect from every nation. These are people whom God can foresee that He will be able to reach. Not everyone will embrace the promise of Jesus. This is sadly observable. Why? I’m not sure the cause or causes. But some will.

The weird modes of transportation are interesting too. I have never brought somebody to church on a dromedary. But this isn’t transportation to a place exactly. This is being involved in diverse ways in people’s lives so that they are connected to Jesus and when we all move past Judgment Day and to the New Jerusalem (Revelation 21-22), we will be like a grain offering that makes God very happy. The New Jerusalem is a place. We just help bring people to Jesus.

“For as the new heavens and the new earth
    that I make
shall remain before me, says the Lord,
    so shall your offspring and your name remain.
23 From new moon to new moon,
    and from Sabbath to Sabbath,
all flesh shall come to worship before me,
declares the Lord.

Isaiah 66:22-23 (ESV)

Eternal life with God is just that–eternal. That is the consistent message of the rest of Scripture. This passage speaks of the permanence of the New Heavens and New Earth, the offspring of the people of faith within Israel, and their name. Part of our experience in Heaven and the New Earth will be worship. Don’t relate that to times you were bored in church. It is also notable that it is “all flesh”. Humans aren’t complete as a disembodied spirit. Paul calls that being “naked” (2 Corinthians 5). We will have a Heavenly Body and a resurrected Earthly body. Worship will be an immersive and positive experience. Everyone will do it. Everyone who is saved that is.

24 “And they shall go out and look on the dead bodies of the men who have rebelled against me. For their worm shall not die, their fire shall not be quenched, and they shall be an abhorrence to all flesh.”

I don’t think that we will make it a part of our eternal routine to observe “dead bodies”. The Bible says that everybody (saved and not) will be a part of the resurrection of our earthly bodies. While this may seem like an amazing and hopeful moment, those who stand judgment bearing their own sin rather than the righteousness we receive from Jesus will find their resurrected bodies are not indestructible. Malachi 4 speaks about them being turned to ash. That will be observable on Judgment Day, probably not after it.

The spirit of a damned person then experiences the ultimate consequence for sin that was completely avoidable. By rejecting Jesus they allowed themselves to bear the full consequence of the Law. They will experience an unending decay (the worm does not die), a fire that is never quenched, be abhorrent to themselves and others, and forsaken by God.

For my part, I wish this ended at verse 23. I can’t deny verse 24 and others like it. Jesus says many will enter destruct and few into life. I hope those relative terms do not mean like they sound. It sure sounds like the majority will experience verse 24.

What Is Hell Fire?

The post contemplates the concept of Hell, defining it as a place of eternal suffering for those without Jesus’ atonement. It explores metaphors used in scripture, such as fire and Hades, to convey the nature of divine judgment. Ultimately, it emphasizes the profound severity of separation from God’s presence in Hell.

It’s a name of a missile, right? It is, but I want to contemplate something else. First, let’s establish a meaning for the word, “Hell”. When I speak of Hell, I am talking about the final place of eternal judgment. It is a post-Judgment Day actual place. It is a place of suffering that includes all who have rebelled against God and have an eternal nature (they don’t just cease to exist) and do not have Jesus’ atonement for their sins. It includes people, Satan, and demons. Jesus uses the word “Gehenna” to refer to it. Revelation calls it the “Lake of Fire”.

Fire, as we have experienced it, is a rapid oxidation resulting in an exothermic reaction. Light a match, that is what is happening. Is that what is happening in Hell, or on Judgment Day (1 Corinthians 3:10f, 2 Peter 3), or even in Sheol? Just a lot of combustion? I doubt it.

When the Bible needs to introduce a concept to us for which we have no frame of reference, it has to use something we know as a metaphor. Fire, as we have experienced it, is similar to the things mentioned above in some way, but it is not necessarily oxidation. I could do this with something in our physical world to help someone with no knowledge of it. I could call nuclear fission a fire. They are both hot.

Let’s start with Sheol/Hades. If you are not familiar with these terms, type them in the search box in the top right of this page. In Luke 16:19-31, Jesus tells the account of the Rich Man and Lazarus. Both are in Hades but one on the “good” side of the chasm and one on the bad side. The Rich Man describes the bad side this way:

24 And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.’

Luke 16:24 (ESV)

Maybe it’s combustion, does it matter? It helps to understand that while all of these use “fire” or “flames”, they are not the same thing and this adds to our understanding of what will happen. Hopefully, we never experience what the Rich Man is experiencing. Jesus is the way to not experience it. For me, it raises the questions of where Sheol is and what is a person’s nature within it. I think it is obvious that Sheol/Hades is not in the center of the Earth as the ancients imagined it. Volcanic activity was just an available metaphor. If it is other dimensional, then do we have a body for Sheol that experiences heat. If this is just their spirit. What can a spirit experience? It suffers to the intensity of being in the scorching heat of a volcanic chamber.

How about the destruction of the universe in 2 Peter 3?

7 But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly.

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed.

2 Peter 3:7,10 (ESV)

The destruction of the universe does sound like a nuclear-type reaction. If fact, during the Cold War, people read this as a nuclear destruction of our own doing. Even nuclear reactions leave molecular remains of slightly less mass. If this verse is being that technical, then this “fire” may go further than even a nuclear fission process.

How about this fire?

13 each one’s work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done.

1 Corinthians 3:13 (ESV)

This fire doesn’t consume anything. It tests and reveals the historical actions of one’s life. More like the Goblet of Fire in Harry Potter. Here the point of comparison may be appearance, just like “tongues of fire” resting the disciples heads on the day of Pentecost. There is some discomfort with this. This is the judgment of our deeds. While not the determining factor in our salvation, it is a probing evaluation of life which will be less than perfect and somewhat embarrassing.

Finally, we get to Hell:

14 Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15 And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Revelation 20:14-15 (ESV)

This is the fire most to be feared. Yet, it is a fire that doesn’t seem to consume anything. Neither combustion nor fission, it deals out eternal suffering. The same questions I applied above to Sheol/Hades apply here. Where is it? Most likely some other dimensional plane that is not connected to the New Universe nor Heaven. Is it just the same as Hades? Here I would refer to what Jesus experienced on the cross to spare us from this fate. He is forsaken by the Father.

The presence of God is a very complicated thing. There is the full blown presence of Heaven at present, but even in Sheol/Hades there is some element of His presence (see Psalm 139). Now Hades is dumped into Hell. Is this somehow completely forsaken and removed entirely from the presence of God? What happens to any part of reality in that situation? Do even spirits burn? The point of contact is clearly the suffering connected with a burn. Is that just the best one can do to describe what happens in a relatable way? The resurrected body, which all receive if briefly (Daniel 12) and is referred to as indestructible (1 Corinthians 13) does prove to be destructible for the damned (Malachi 4). In Hell as person does not have this body. Stripped down in their nature to probably just the spirit, Satan, rebellious angels, and the damned among mankind experience what it is like to be forever out of the presence of God. I don’t care to have a fully relatable experience to this.